Transcript:
Robert: I welcome you with all my heart. What can I tell you that you do not already know? I can only give my own confession. When I use the pronoun “I,” I refer to omnipresence. So when I make my confession I do not speak of myself. It involves all of us. I am is consciousness. Consciousness is omnipresence. When I say, “I am that I am” it means in reality we are nothing but pure consciousness. It’s like a chalkboard. You may draw pictures on the chalkboard of Indians and they’re fighting the cowboys, but what happens to the chalkboard? Nothing. You can erase that picture and draw another picture. This time you’re drawing the beach and the sun and the sand and it’s a beautiful balmy day about seventy-five degrees. What happens to the chalkboard? Nothing. Now you erase that and you draw a storm or hurricane. People are getting blown away – winds ninety miles an hour – what happens to the chalkboard? Nothing. This is true of our lives. Whatever you experience you’re going through, whatever the experience maybe. I can assure you that it has absolutely nothing to do with you. Whether you’re going through a horrendous experience, a beautiful experience, you are like the chalkboard. It is only a picture, a play on consciousness. You are free. You are bright and shiny all the time. Like the sun. Sometimes the clouds cover the sun, do you say, “There’s no sun?” When the clouds dissipate, the sun shines once again in all its glory and splendor. So, when you appear to have problems, whatever they may be. Do not go about trying to solve your problems like everybody else. But rather remove the clouds of darkness. Allow the clouds to dissipate. How do you do that? By quieting the mind. When the mind is quiet. The sun of your heart will shine once again and you will be free of problems. [Break in tape as Robert begins self confession for everyone] I-am that. I-am that absolute reality. That was never born and will never cease to exist. I-am pure intelligence. The same yesterday, today and tomorrow. I-am empty space. Nirvana. I-am sat-chit-ananda — being, existence, bliss. I-am bliss consciousness. Water cannot drown me. Fire cannot burn me. I have always been and will always be. This is the truth it is unchanging. Like the chalkboard. No matter what pictures appear it has absolutely nothing to do with me. I abide in the Self. The Self is my protection. The Self is my Self. I may appear to have a body, a mind, but this is an untruth. This is hypnosis, mesmerism, illusion, maya. In reality I am not the body or mind. I am not the doer. I am pure consciousness, absolute reality, parabrahman. That is the truth. Ah, somebody called me this morning, she isn’t here today. She wanted me to say something about spiritual healing. Think about that spirit, spiritual healing? Who has to be healed spiritually, Who can tell me? Student: Nobody Robert: That’s the answer, that’s right. There is no one who needs spiritual healing. But in our delusion we see a different picture. People tell me, “Well, Christ healed people, how come?” How come? I don’t know. Because he felt like, I guess. That was his dharma. But, did you ever wonder what happened to those people after they were healed? (laughs) Take for instance Lazarus, that he brought back from the dead. To begin with Lazarus was about 50 years old and in those days to live to 50 years old was like 90 years old today. He was considered old. So when he brought him back from the dead, how long did he live, after that? Did he live forever? A year, a month, a day? Nobody knows. The people he healed from blindness, leprosy or whatever, how long did they stay healed? He said, “Go and sin no more!” meaning, do not keep thinking the way you’re thinking. Because it is your mind that caused your so-called problem. Of course, they didn’t understand what he was talking about and you can’t change your mind so fast. So apparently they reverted back to their sickness. So it would seem. If you abide in the Self, there’s no one that has to be healed. There’s another story about Ramana Maharshi. One of his female disciples, who had been with him for about forty years or so. She was a devotee, was lying and living in the house of a disciple. Remember the difference between a disciple and a devotee. A disciple is someone who occasionally comes to the meetings and who reads all kinds of materials and gets confused and goes to a hundred different meetings a week and never practices anything, that’s a disciple. A devotee is someone who stays with the meeting or with the person and lives for that meeting and for that teaching. So anyway, his devotee was in bed dying of cancer and a disciple was taking care of her. And she said to her, “Look what’s happening to you” and she started crying. “Is this what Bhagvan has done to you? If this is Bhagvan then I don’t want any part of him.” This is the disciple talking. “Look at you, you’re emaciated, you’re skin and bones, you’re dying, how could this happen to you, you were such a devotee to Bhagvan for forty years?” Hearing this, the devotee shot up in bed, she shot up fast and she said, “You fool is this what Bhagvan means to you? It is your mind that sees this picture. I am not dying, how can I die? It is you who see this picture. That’s why you cry. You think that I am a body and you feel sorry for the body so you become upset with Bhagvan, me and yourself. Can’t you see that I am not the body. There’s no one to be sick, there’s no one to die.” And she had a beautiful look and smile on her face and with that she lied back down and she left her body. And she had the most gracious look. A beatific look on her smile. When Bhagwan heard this story he said, “She’s not coming back, she’s emancipated.” What do we see? When we look at the world do we see lack, limitation, man’s inhumanity to man. Do we sickness poverty, wars or do we see love, harmony, peace, joy? What we really see is ourselves. If you become hurried and worried and you’re always believing something negative is going to come your way and you’re always making plans ahead of time, to save yourself, you’re really killing yourself. You do not understand that your mind has created that picture for you and the way to handle it is to not try to improve the condition but to slow down your mind. To make the mind quiescent, quiet, still, peaceful, placid. When the mind becomes placid and quiet and still, divine harmony automatically ensues. Every negative condition you see in the world is a lie. Every positive condition you see in the world is a lie. Reality is beyond positive and negative. Why do you see these things? Why do you worry and fret about your life or about the life of someone else? What can possibly happen to you? Where can you go? Who suffers? Only the body-ego-mind suffers. To the extent that you can realize that you are not the body-ego mind, to that extent do you become totally, absolutely free. I think I told you this story about when I was with Nimkarali Baba. And one of his devotees came to him and said, “Master, my husband is dying, only you can save him.” And he was a funny old guy, he looked around and he said, “Me? I can save him?” he looked to all his devotees and he said, “What should I do?” and his devotees said, “Go save him.” So he said, “Okay.” So we all trudged a mile down the road, to a little shack and there was her husband in bed with candles all around him, lying there. Nimkarali Baba looked at him and as he was looking the candles started flickering and they went out. So Nimkarali Baba started to run back to his Ashram and everybody ran with him. When he got back there they asked him, “Master why did you run away? What happened?” And he turned around and he said, “Ah God wants him to die.” And that was the end of that. In other words, what a persons dharma is, is going to happen, but you have absolutely nothing to do with it. That includes yourself. Whatever your body is going through has been preordained before you took on this so-called body. And your body’s going to go through whatever it has to go through. You have to realize that you are not the body and you have absolutely nothing to do with it. To that extent that you realize this truth to that extent will you become happy and peaceful and you will stop worrying and fretting and stop trying to change things. You will be peaceful by yourself, at home, wherever you are. You will be in the world but not of the world. So spiritual healing is a lie, because it presumes somebody is sick or somebody is out of sorts or somebody is suffering from something. Whether it’s depression or lack of companionship, whatever it may be. This is all a lie and you have to start knowing the truth. Look into yourself. This doesn’t mean that you should sit down and do nothing. It means whatever your body’s meant to do, it’s going to do. Even though it doesn’t exist. Your body is really your Atman. It is pure consciousness. It is absolute reality. This is what your body is. This is the reason why you should never put yourself down and call yourself names and think you’re bad or you’re weak or there’s something wrong with you. You are not what appears. When you make statements like that, negative statements about yourself, what you’re really doing is getting pulled back into maya, deeper and deeper and deeper into illusion, into body-mind consciousness, into the dream and the dream becomes more real for you and you get caught up in it completely. It’s like you’re watching a movie and instead of watching, you jump into the screen and want to play a part of the movie and you forget that you’re not part of the movie. But you start acting out the movie until you get so caught up in it that you actually think that you’re in the movie. That’s how it is now. Think about yourselves and the socalled experiences that you’re going through. How deep are you caught up in them? Think, you can tell about the way you feel. If you fear, if you have doubts, apprehension, suspicion, then you know you’re really caught up in your slime. I’m thinking of the green slime I drink every morning. (laughter) So you say, “What about you? You drink green slime, how come?” Well what I do every morning is I just get up. Spontaneously I throw everything in the blender, I don’t think about it. Whether it’s making me sick or well or whatever it’s doing. And I mix it all together and then I pour it on the granola and then I eat it. I happen to enjoy the taste or I wouldn’t eat it. I wouldn’t do it if I didn’t like it. But when I’m finished that’s the end of it. I don’t think about it. I don’t condemn it or justify it, I just do it. So I go about everything that way, spontaneous. Now you think, if you think about that you are not the body, your body will not function properly. Or you will get into trouble. You will only get into trouble when you’re putting on an act. In other words when you’re pretending to be spiritual. But when you’re a real devotee of truth, of the Self, automatically, your body so-called is well taken care of. You have intuition. It comes by itself you don’t even know it’s intuition. You do the right things for all concerned. And it happens by itself and it can be real funny like this story I’m going to tell you. There was once a real cheap skate. Real cheap, had millions of dollars. But always cried poor mouth. Couldn’t afford a bus fare so he walked. Couldn’t afford to buy a glass of lemonade so he was thirsty, real cheap. I’m sure you know people like that. Well he got old and was about to die and he had guilt feelings because he never helped anybody else with his money. He just hoarded it, he had millions of dollars saved in the banks. But he believed in heaven and hell. So he kept worrying about this. “So what shall I do?” He consequently sent for a priest, a minister and a rabbi. And he thought about this and he said, “Listen, here’s what I’m going to do. I am going to give you each three million dollars if you pray for me to go to heaven.” So they all talked about it and looked at each other and they said, “Well three million dollars, not bad. (laughter) They said, “Okay, we’ll do it.” So he made out his will and they all signed it. Six months later the Priest, the Rabbi and the Minister received a notice that the guy was dying and was going to die. They went to his side and he looked at them and he said, “Oh okay I’m going to give you the money,” but he started to think about this. And a thought came to him, and the thought said, “What if they discover something to bring me back from the dead years from now? And I’ll be cured and healed and I won’t be dead anymore. So if I give them my money now, I won’t have anything when I come back.” But then he wasn’t sure and so he said, “Okay, here’s what I’ll do, I’ll give you each five million dollars instead of three with this condition. When I die and you file pass my coffin, you each have to drop a million dollars in the coffin. So if I come back and they discover something to cure me and bring me back from the dead, I’ll have a nice amount of money.” So they all looked at him like he was crazy and they talked it over and they said, “Well what the heck four million is better than nothing,” and they agreed. He finally died. And he had a funeral and his casket was laid open and everybody filed passed and they looked. The minister filed passed the coffin and looked down at him and he said, “Well you son of a bitch, I don’t know what I’m doing and what you’re going to do with the money, but a promise is a promise,” and he threw a million dollars in the coffin. Next the priest came by and he said, “Well, this is all crazy, but this is what you want okay” and he threw a million dollars in the coffin. Now the Rabbi watched all this and he said, “There must be some solution to this.” And he was going to Jnana-Marga meetings, the Rabbi. And he was working from his intuition. So he filed by and looked at the money in the casket. He took out his cheque-book and wrote a cheque for three million dollars and picked up the two million in cash and he said, “When they find a cure for you you can cash your cheque. (students laugh) And isn’t this like us. We always imagine somebody’s going to heal us. We go and see all these healers, psychics, channelers, everybody in town. We want advice from psychic readings. We want to know what’s going to happen to us. What can possibly happen to you, if you were never born to begin with? You have no history. You are pure consciousness. Forget about healings. Forget about psychics. Forget about readers and channelers. Look to your Self for the answers. Everything is within you. Learn to be still. Find out who’s worried, who fears, who’s unhappy, who’s depressed, who’s sick and you will say, “I am, but who am I?” and follow the I to its source. And the “I” will disappear of its own accord. The realization will come, that you are absolute reality and that all is well and everything is unfolding as it should. (tape break as Robert continues) Govinda and Gopala are different names for Krishna. Gopala is baby Krishna. There’s only one reason why people suffer, and that is because they identify with the body-mind phenomena. That is the only reason there’s no other reason. I know you can give me a lot of reasons but they are not real. If you take your mind off your body and then you get rid of your mind completely who’s left to suffer? And you must ask yourself, “Who sees the suffering? I do. Well, who’s the “I” that sees that suffering?” Find out. Follow the I and see who suffers. Any questions about that? Any questions about anything? Remember I am not a lecturer. SL: What does it mean to follow the I? R: It means to abide in your Self. The I is your Self. It starts out as the ego but as you follow the I, it becomes your Self. And your Self has no existence. Therefore, it becomes no-thing, emptiness, space. Like the blackboard, the chalkboard. Everything happens around it, on it, but it itself is not affected. That’s what it means to follow the I. The I becomes your Self and you abide in your Self. SD: Robert, maybe if you explain self-inquiry and that will maybe explain following the Ithought. (R: Well they know self-inquiry.) Pardon? R: They know about self-inquiry, don’t you? SD: (Asks another student) Do you understand how suffering follows the I-thought? SL: I can understand it subtly. SM: Egolessness in all things. R: Exactly, there is no cause for existence. If there is no cause for existence, there is no cause for suffering or for anything else. It simply has no cause. It didn’t come from anywhere. History is like a dream. It never existed. When you back into egolessness, everything that’s been troubling you becomes transcended and you’re at peace with yourself and the world. For the realization becomes that you are the world. You are the universe. The whole universe emanates out of your mind. And when your mind stops, the universe stops and there’s only the Self. The Self appears as bliss consciousness as I-am, and that’s your real nature. SN: Robert until we come to that realization, then we don’t know the Self, is that true? R: No it’s not true. You always know the Self, except you won’t admit it, you want to admit something else. You are confessing that you don’t know the Self. But it’s not true. Just let go of all your doubts and the Self will shine once again. Do not believe that you don’t know the Self. Don’t question it too much. Realize it. Become it and put your doubts at rest. I am the Self that has always existed and will always exist. It will never cease to exist. I am pure intelligence, absolute reality, consciousness, emptiness, space. I am that I am. That’s your real nature. Confess that to yourself. Do not tell yourself that you’re not the Self, because you’re lying. It’s like saying, “There’s no sun,” because the clouds are covering the sun and you’re swearing up and down saying, “look Robert there’s no sun the sun doesn’t exist!” but if I take you up in an airplane above the clouds there’s the sun. It’s the same thing as us. We’re so covered with delusion that we believe that we’re not the Self. Be Still And Know That I Am God. Therefore, you just have to be still long enough and know and all will be well. SN: But until then do we know? (R: Until when?) Until then. R: There’s no then. There’s no time that you are not the Self. SN: I’ve been examining this, see when we are asleep, the Self is no different? R: The I-am is always the same. Because when you get up you say, “I slept.” Who slept? I dreamt. SN: I seem to be identifying I-am with consciousness, when we spoke of consciousness before. Say for instance, the Self in between thought is the I-am, that is consciousness, yet when I sleep there’s no consciousness, there’s nothing. So I-am is just nothing. R: You think there’s nothing. (SN: Right.) But when you get up you say, “I slept.” I was always present. I-am is always present. Even when you’re sleeping, except you’re not conscious of it. (SN: So when you become realized though, you’re conscious even when you sleep?) Exactly. SD: A Jnani is conscious of dreaming and of dreaming within the dream. SN: So until we’re realized – see I’m trying to make a connection of the Self – and so I say, “Well when I’m asleep I’m not aware of the Self, so when I’m awake am I awareness?” So I’m trying not to delude myself. R: What you should rather do is say, “When I am asleep who is aware of the Self?” Ask yourself that question. “When I sleep who is aware of the Self?” And you will realize Iam. You are always aware of the Self except when you sleep. You’re not conscious of it. But it still goes on. SB: Robert is it because when you’re asleep, the consciousness is not associated with the physical brain. Is that it? R: No, the physical brain has nothing to do with it. When you’re asleep you’re dreaming just like when you’re awake. This waking state is just like the dream state. So we don’t say it’s just because we’re associating with the brain. It’s because we’re deluded into believing that we are not the Self. So you make it simple. The brain has nothing to do with it because the brain is part of the body. If the body does not exist, neither does the brain. So when you’re sleeping the brain is at rest, the body’s at rest but you’re still abiding in the Self. You’re always abiding in the Self except you are not conscious of it. (SB: What happens to the consciousness that is…?) Nothing. It’s still there, except just like now. Let’s take the waking state. You say, “What happens to reality while I’m awake?” Reality is still there but you still believe in the body and the mind. It’s just like I give you an example of the sky is blue. In reality there’s no sky and there’s no blue. So in reality there’s no body and there’s no one to be unconscious. (SB: When you abide in consciousness in the waking state will that help you to actually be conscious of the sleep, the deep sleep state also?) Yes it will, because there is only one state. SB: In some of the Ramana books it says when you’re abiding in the Self more and more your deep sleep will be conscious. (R: Yes.) One time I was in deep sleep and I like was aware, I was actually conscious that I was deep asleep and it was like being in a cave. There was like awareness, it was very strange. R: That’s a good sign, that’s how it is. When you become realized… SB: It was like a very sweet bliss not a powerful ecstasy but a kind of like a, just a background kind of just a vague but very sweet bliss and it was like being in a cave. It looked like a cave and it was like asleep while awake. R: Well those are just pictures you drew for yourself. But when you awaken, you will be awake in the three states, sleeping, dreaming and waking. SB: So if we can hold onto this position of consciousness that we have at satsang, if we can maintain that pure consciousness without adding the whole mind to it and be established in that then that’s the… R: That’s abiding in the I, exactly. (SB: So that’s all it is, really.) That’s all it is. (SB: Right this minute we’re that, if we don’t add the whole me on top of it.) Exactly so and you don’t put yourself down, do not say, “I am not conscious of my Self. I don’t know who I-am,” realize the truth like you just said. SB: And yet for this moment we’re abiding in the Self without the mind, we can’t say that we’re God realized because there’s a certain process that happens that actually, right? (R: It’s better to say nothing.) Yeah, because there is a process that happens as a person establishes in that. Something happens. R: Every time you say, “I am not God realized” you pull yourself backwards. But like Nerada said, don’t fool yourself. So you have to walk the middle path, the razors edge, between realization and not realization. SB: So actually we’re just hung up with the relations of consciousness and the associations of consciousness and we’re just not being pure consciousness, without adding all those associations on top of it. (R: True.) That’s it. (R: That’s it.) SF: Robert, actually this body-mind will never abide in the Self? (R: No, because it’s false.) So when I say, “I am abiding in the Self,” when I make that suggestion it means — it’s an expression rather than being. R: It’s an expression. It means I am is abiding in the Self. (SF: The I-am?) The I-am. Same thing as the Self. It’s an expression like you say. But when you say I am you’re not referring to your body. (SF: Not to your mind?) Not referring to your mind, you’re referring to your Self. It’s like saying, “I am that I am.” The same thing. “I-am abiding in the Self, I am that I am.” By saying these things to yourself, it pulls you closer to that state. (SF: Yeah it’s sort of a process of elimination of your ego self.) You can say that. That’s why you shouldn’t say anything negative about yourself. Never say anything bad about yourself. Always say, “I am abiding in the Self, I am the Self.” And then somebody might say to you, something this “I” can say, “No I’m not because I feel problems.” So you practice self-inquiry and you ask yourself, “Who feels these problems? To whom do they come?” and go back to abiding in the Self. (tape break) R: The only reason karma exists is because you believe that you are the body. Once you realize there’s no body. For whom is there karma. Karma is for the body not for your Self. But as long as you don’t believe that, then there’s karma. SD: And Robert has also explained to us that self-realization gets you off the wheel. SN: Robert, when we’re asleep are we closer or further away. R: Closer, self-realization is just like being in deep sleep. In deep sleep, only you’re conscious and you’re conscious of bliss. So when you’re in deep sleep you’re in bliss but you’re not conscious of it, that’s all. SN: Now when we’re in satsang and we have devotional feelings — say when we come to satsang to develop something, attaining something, that we don’t get when we’re alone or in the world, when we come to satsang and feel something, a devotional feeling, is that the Self? R: That’s the Self trying to emerge. Yes, it’s the self. Try to abide in those feelings. (SN: Now when we’re asleep though, it’s more, it’s like without emotion.) Because you’re asleep you’re not conscious, but if you were conscious you’d be in bliss. (SN: But it would be different than the feeling it when we have for devotion?) No it wouldn’t. It would be self-realization. (SN: In other words, the feeling that I get is a love for all things. Okay, yet when I’m asleep it’s not like love.) How do you know? (SN: Yeah, well I don’t.) You’re asleep? (SN: Yeah that’s the whole thing. I’m trying to make a connection — is that what the feeling is?) The feeling of love abides when you’re asleep only you’re not aware of it because you’re not conscious. When you’re illumined then you’re conscious of being in sleep and then you realize that it’s just called sleep, but you’re in love, you’re in bliss. (SN: Now that love is the Self?) The love is the Self. (SN: But what comes to mind is you ask, “Well who loves?”) Why should you ask that? (SN: Well only to not delude yourself. To see well is this real or is this just another play of the mind?) That’s only when you love your tape recorder more than anything else. So you ask yourself, “Who loves my tape recorder?” and you will realize it’s your ego and once the ego is abolished there is only a tape recorder. Period. SF: Robert, even the egoic love, egotistical love or the love of the Jnani for persons or objects, to me that kind of thing should be the love of the Self that has been misdirected? R: Yes it does, exactly. Whatever you do in life, even a crook or a bank robber is really trying to find himself. That’s why he does those things. We’re all inadvertently searching for the Self and we don’t know it. (SF: So every desire which is attracting me is the Self?) Yes, every desire, every urge is a search for the Self. But we’re misdirected. (SF: With self-inquiry what you do is you go deep, down the hole?) You go beyond the conscious and you jump deep like you’re diving in the ocean. You dive deeper and deeper and deeper till you make contact with reality. That’s good. SF: Robert, about when the Jnani talks about omniscience and says, “I’m omniscient.” The Jnani has a concept about omniscience and it’s a mundane type of omniscience. The Jnani says he’s omniscience, he must know everything. He must know all the mundane knowledge. That’s not what implies in the statements of the Jnani, right? R: Your right! Omniscient for the Jnani is being in everything, but not necessarily knowing what’s going on in China. That’s a different kind of omniscience. SF: Because people are using nowadays omniscience they say to be channelers. (R: Yes.) They think they are channelers, they are very knowledgeable and sort of think that is a form of omniscience. But that’s not what we call a Jnani. (R: That’s a limited form of omniscience.) Yeah. SD: Is omniscience the same as omnipresent? R: Omniscience is all-knowing, all-knowing. Omnipresence is the same thing, really. It’s all presence. You’re everywhere present. (SD: Aren’t they the same?) It’s like omnipotence, omniscience, omnipresence. All power, all knowledge like being everywhere at the same time. (SD: You were saying, not necessarily knowing what going on in China but it’s knowing the oneness of all things?) Yes. It’s like you become the rock, but you’re asleep on the rock, because the rock has no power to move, but you become the rock. (SD: When you are omnipresence you are a rock?) Yes. You become a rock but you’re not aware of it. You just are pure unconscious awareness. (SD: So you’re not aware of anything, exactly.) (Robert laughs) You’re on the right track. You’re just being. Pure being. Absolute being. You’re everything. It’s something like when you’re asleep and you expand yourself in a dream and in that dream you know what’s going on in the dream, but you’re asleep. So with a Jnani being omnipresent, omniscient, you are everything but you are not aware of everything. (SD: You’re aware of being then.) You’re aware of being, just being. SK: Is there a way to be aware of everything as well? R: As long as you are carrying a body, you won’t be aware of any other thing because your mental process won’t allow that to happen. SD: It seems like if you’re aware of it, everything is an illusion to be aware of it, right? R: When you drop your body, it’s no different. When you drop your body, there’s no difference, you expand a little bit more. SB: Robert, how come the Buddhist say, that the Vedanta are deluded because they’re looking for the Brahman and the Self and that there’s no Brahman and no Self and use different terminology? Is there emptiness of all things the same as the Self when it happens? R: They’re right! Because there is no Brahman and there is no Self. Those are just words to describe it. (SB: It’s easy to confuse the ego-self with the real-Self.) That’s why we discuss it, because the ego-self is the I and when the I disappears it becomes the I-am. And the I-am is pure emptiness. Nirvana. SN: Robert, when you said the best way to help other people is to know the Self. So when you know the Self you become the other people. (SM: And realize that you are the other people.) So, that’s what I was trying to get at earlier. To get to know what is the Self? What is the Self that we must know? And it seems like sometimes I know what it is and then I forget. And now it comes back to me, I feel that. If I have a feeling of love it’s like it becomes expansive and I can understand what it means. You become everything or everything becomes you or whatever it is. SD: So is self-realization the awareness or the oneness of everything? R: Always remember If you know what it is, it’s not that, because the finite mind cannot know. It’s beyond the finite. So when you think you know, ask yourself, “Who knows?” And you back to your ego again. Only the ego knows. (SN: But what if you say, “Who knows?”) That’s good. (laughter) SK: What about a realized being that whoever comes before them so-to-speak, they can know everything about them. Not only what their Self is because it’s the same as their own Self but about their arrogance of the ego and mind conflicts? R: You don’t have to be a realized being to do that. SK: Yeah I realize that. So taking an opinion from a being who is considered to be realized also that happens. He can remark when it’s spontaneous that something about that being that maybe will turn them towards a spiritual path. Like Jesus healing others. R: But a true realized being does not need to do that. By his very presence, changes take place. (SK: But not everyone is so receptive or open.) It’s just like grace. Gods grace is always available but only some people pick it up. (SK: Yeah.) The same thing. SK: So sometimes that grace for me seems to be extended and then some action that can be done that that person can understand more than just subtly. And it may not take effect then but it may take effect in that persons life six months, a year down the road. R: That’s possible, but again, a realized being does not interfere in anybody’s karma, if they are prepared and ready, they become realized also. By their very presence. It’s like Ramana again, we go back to Ramana. People used to come to him from far and wide and say, “I looked at your picture and healed myself, you healed me.” “I made a million dollars and you did it.” This happened and that happened. And Ramana would look at his attendant that pulls the fan and say, “Why do they always tell me I did these things? I did nothing.” (SD: But his grace might of done it.) That’s possible. (SD: Because he could give the darshan.) But he couldn’t possibly be aware of it. Because to be aware of it there would have to be somebody left to be aware. (SD: But he could do it unaware?) Yes. SK: He didn’t say anything to people who came to him. (R: No.) SN: Even when it’s his grace, you have to understand that everything is one. So who’s grace is it. (SK: Who’s grace is it?) Right who’s grace is it? It’s you! Everything is you and this is similar to the stories when the person touched the garment of Jesus and was healed and Christ always said, “Be it according to your faith.” SM: Don’t you think that a person who wants to be healed so badly almost heals himself? SN: That’s the whole point, everything is the Self. (SM: It is the Self.) And Ramana was the Self, and they say, “Ramana you did this” and that’s true because they did it themselves, because they are them. R: Well the point is, a truly realized being, does nothing. SN: It’s not so much he’s a realized being, he’s a realized non-being. (laughter) (R: Okay.) And we always think in terms of a realized being of Ramana as if he’s the body and the idea of the Self is one. Robert told the story of the woman, he and himself is one, healing and the Self is one and Ramana and the Self is one, and that Self… see I always try to grasp this Self with my mind and that’s where I get lost. But now I know if I sink into deeper than the mind, intuition, heart, whatever, then I can explain, Oh that… SB: In other words he realized no Self. He realized that there isn’t any Self. He realized nothingness. But the whole thing dissolves in a big mystery. (R: Exactly.) And then whatever is going to happen is going to happen spontaneously. R: Ramana was a simply humble person. People would come to him with all his problems, all their problems all day long. “Help me, please help me overcome this.” At the end of the day he would look at his attendant and say, “To whom shall I go for help?” They all come to me. SD: One of my favorite stories is that there was a swami who could perform tricks or magic or whatever and he lived near the Ashram. So a lot of people on their way to see the swami would stop by to see Maharshi. They’d just peek in at him because they’ve heard about him too and he told one of his devotees because he had a lot of trouble with his feet he said, “keep rubbing my feet and they’ll see that I am just an old sick man and they’ll leave me alone. (laughter) R: There’s nothing special about a realized being. SF: Robert it seems that with a little understanding, using quotation mark, “If there is a Jnani, or anybody approaches him, is karmic, all karmic.” all karma. (R: Yes, Yes, that’s true.) However, the fact that there is hypocrisy on that quotation on the Self because the presence of the Jnani, there can be, maybe a sort of acceleration, a catalytic effect… (R: That’s true too.) …and that also is karmic? (R: That’s also true.) Depending on the openness of the disciple, devotees? R: Yes, the teaching is full of contradictions. That’s true, you’re right. All these things are true. SB: So Robert, you’re really going into battle with your karma. (laughter) Confrontations with our ignorance, right? R: If that’s what you say, so be it. You see this is why I emphasize over and over again, we’ve got to develop a great humility, a great compassion, a great love. Not play tricks and have all these siddhas, powers and materialize all kinds of things. Anybody can learn that, if you practice enough. SK: How does one express these things? (R: Express what?) Compassion and love. R: By being your Self. If you become your Self it’s automatic. If you abide in the Self. You have to have compassion and love for yourself first and you do that by letting go of your thoughts. Controlling your thoughts and compassion and love and humility come by themselves. It always goes back to that again. Goes back to you. You can’t develop enough love yourself. It has to come from within yourself. It appears that the world has a very strong pull on us and you have to try to resist that by everyday practicing these things. That’s why I gave you all these techniques. You have to keep remembering everyday. And soon it’ll become automatic. I feel this is a very important meditation to help us. For what it does, it goes deep within the subconscious and pretty soon it starts doing you, instead of you doing it, it’s really helped many people to see the way. And the way you do this is, you relax yourself and with your breathing you inhale and you say, “I,” you exhale and you say, “am.” Now you can also do this all day long. When you’re driving your car or your bus, whether you’re washing dishes, whether you’re making supper or dinner or breakfast. You can watch your breath and do I-am with your breathing. So let’s do it together. Make yourself comfortable and you can close your eyes to remove obstructions. Acquire a good feeling in yourself and the formal way to do it is first, you relax your body. To make sure every part of you is relaxed. You can start with your knees, relax your knees. Relax everything below your knees, your feet, your toes. Relax everything above your knees, your thighs, relax your hips, your abdominals relax, your chest relax, relax your back, fingers, hands, wrists, forearms relax, upper arms relax, shoulders, neck. Back of your neck relax. Back of your head, top of your head. Your forehead, your face. Every part of you is now totally relaxed. Focus your attention on your breathing. Before you do I-am, you can practice Vipassana meditation, Buddhist meditation, where you watch your breath. Watch yourself breathing. Watch the sensations in your body. Just watch. Do not react to them. For instance, if you have a pain in your thigh, watch, do not react to it, observe it and observe your breath at the same time. Do not force your breath just breath naturally. If you get lost in thoughts, as soon as you catch yourself, go back to your breathing. Do not become discouraged. Do not force your thoughts out, ignore them and go back to observing your breathing. (short silence) Now you ask yourself the question, “Who is the observer? Who observes my breathing?” Of course the answer is, “I am.” Now with your breathing start the “I am” meditation. Inhale normally, say, “I,” exhale and say, “am,” with your normal breathing, do not emphasize your breath. Normal breathing, “I am.” “I” inhale, “am” exhale. Again, if your mind wanders, do not be mad at yourself but gently go back to “I am” and ignore your thoughts. (long silence and break in tape as Robert wraps up) Remember to love your Self, to worship your Self, to pray to your Self, to bow to your Self because God dwells in you, as you. Om Shanti, Peace. Happy you could come. See you again soon. That’s all she wrote. (tape ends)