Transcript:
Robert: Hello. (Hello.) Welcome to the…what do we call ourselves? The being nobody group. (students laugh) Because when you leave here you will be no-body. If you want to be somebody you came to the wrong place. We are a bunch of nobodies. How many of you are here for the first time? Please do not be dismayed by what you hear. I am not a lecturer. I am not a philosopher. I am not a sermonizer. Is there such a word as a sermonizer? SH: Um-hm. (agrees) R: I’ve heard of womanizer. (SB: Are you a womanizer?) I’m not a sermonizer. SA: One up from a womanizer. (laughs) (SF: That’s it Arnold, keep quiet!) SL: Very good Fred. Robert continues: We’re one big happy family here. Some families aren’t too happy. (laughter) So we’re one big family, so we’re one big, we’re one… I want to thank most of you for sharing your Christmas and Chanukah gifts with me. It’s very unusual being in Los Angeles. In the past I never used to take anything that was given to me. But since I got to Los Angeles things have changed. (laughter) Anyway, thanks. I received a phone call this morning from somebody who isn’t here now. They asked me to elaborate on the question that Glen asked last week. (Glen’s in the corner.) His question was, “Does a realized person, a Sage, a Jnani become angry?” and I briefly touched on that. I was most succinct, didn’t say too much about it. Somebody wanted me to elaborate on that for some reason. It’s an interesting question. Humans get angry. Therefore when you’ve reached self-realization, do you still have feelings of anger, of rage, or outrage? A question like this is usually asked by a seeker or a disciple. A devotee couldn’t care less. When you ask a question like this you’re asking from the viewpoint of the ajnani, and there are different answers. It’s very paradoxical. It reminds me of the time I was initiated by Paramahansa Yogananda in selfrealization when I was 17, prior to going to India to see Ramana Maharshi. And during the initiation I was on my knees and he put his hand on my head and he said, “Robert, do you promise to love me no matter what I do, or no matter what you think you see me do?” I hesitated. I said to myself, “What is he going to do? Is he going to kill somebody, and wants me to love him no matter what he does?” But then I also realized that I didn’t have all the answers. So I said, “Yes.” It’s only by being around two or three months that I realized what he meant. He reacted differently to different people, to different personalities. It was Christmas and he was living with the monks in Encinitas at that time. So I recall one monk came over to him and said, “Master,” they called him Master, “may I go visit my family at Christmas time? I’ll be gone two weeks.” He became very sweet and he said, “Of course you can. You should see your family. They miss you. Go and have a good time and come back in two weeks.” Then somebody else came and kneeled before him and he said, “Master, may I go see my family during Christmas?” He became outraged and started screaming at the monk and said, “How dare you ask me a question like this. Why do you want to see your family? They don’t want to see you. Of course you can’t go. Don’t ask stupid questions. Go back to your quarters,” This was the dilemma, same questions different answers. I consequently realized that he was able to read into the person. He knew exactly what was going on with each person. He couldn’t possibly give the same answer to two different people. He realized the first person had a loving family, and the first person had high self-esteem, so it wouldn’t matter where the person goes. Their heart is always on truth, on reality, on God. But the second person had a low self-esteem, and if he left he would be dragged by the powers of maya back into reality, of materiality that is, the reality of materiality and he probably wouldn’t even come back again. That’s why he gave that answer. And so it is with the answer to the question that Glen asked. Sometimes a Sage puts on an act, fakes it for the benefit of the devotees or the disciples or the seekers. It’s necessary. If you recall the incident with Jesus and the money changers, Jesus supposedly got very angry when he went to the temple and saw all of the merchants selling their wares on the steps of the temple. He overturned the table and said, “How dare you do this in my Fathers house?” and chased them all away. It appears he also got angry. But did he? When you speak of a Sage, of a Jnani, supposedly they are transcendent. They’ve transcended. They have no ego, no personality left. So what gets angry? It is the ego that gets angry, the mind. If there is no ego-mind left how can you possibly become angry? Therefore a true Sage, a Jnani, can never really become angry for he doesn’t have the mechanism to become angry again. It’s been transcended. It’s like the story of the Zen monk who came to the Master and said, “Master, I’m always getting angry. I can’t help it. What should I do?” So the Master took out his sword and cut off his head and said, “Let’s see you get angry now.” And as the story goes, he became enlightened. His head flew back on and he was realized. There is noone to become angry. Think about yourself. You have emotions, you become angry, you have all kinds of psychological symptoms. Where did they come from? Why are they there? You have to ask yourself, “Why do I become angry? Why do I have these emotions? Why do I allow my mind to think past my nose? I’m responsible for my own life.” That’s how you should talk to yourself. “If I have all these negative emotions, how can I possibly function in the world? I blame others. I see the faults of others. I’m always judging. I’m always criticizing. Am I right? Even though if I appear to be right, I’m wrong. I’m wrong simply because I do not understand the universe. I usually get angry because things are not going my way. The world is not turning the way I want it to, so I criticize, I judge, for I believe things should be this way instead of that way. I believe people should do this instead of that. I believe this person should be this way instead of that way. Why do I believe this?” This is the way you should talk to yourself. “What is it that’s in me that makes me this way? Is it a power? Is it a force? Is it some kind of entity? Am I possessed? Actually who am I? Who am I with this great temper, with this anger?” And as you keep inquiring, “Who am I?” you will begin to focus on the I. “Who am I? What is this I? I am always referring to I. I am angry. I am disillusioned. I have a bad temper. Why if this I weren’t here there would be no one to experience these verities I just mentioned.” So what is the source of I? The problem really isn’t the temper or the anxiety or the depression. The problem is the I. It is the I who has this problem, not me. Subsequently the secret is to dissolve the I, to annihilate the I. For I reason out that if the I is destroyed there will be no one left to get this problem. So how do I dissolve the I? Simply by inquiring, “Where did the I come from?” I wake up, I say, “I slept.” I had a dream, I wake up, I say, “I dreamt.” I am awake, I say, “Now I am awake.” I feel depressed, I say, “I am depressed,” There is always I. Reasoning will tell you that all of your troubles are attached to I. The troubles have no validity by themselves. The disappointments or the disillusionments, the anger, the temper, they have no validity. It is the I that appears to have validity. So where did the I come from? Who gave it birth? Who feels it? Again, I do. It’s always I. Who am I? What is the source of the I? By holding on to the I and following it to the source it will dissolve. It will disappear of its own accord. So you inquire. Whenever you have a problem you must ask yourself, “To whom does it come?” It makes no difference how many problems you may have. It makes no difference what is disturbing you, how serious your particular problem may loom in your mind. The method is always the same: “To whom does it come? Why it comes to me.” Me is the same as I. You hold on to the me or you hold on to the I. You do not concentrate on the I. You concentrate on the source of the I. But you hold on to the I like you’re holding on to a rope. You’re climbing down to the end of the rope. And every time you say to yourself, “Who am I?” or “What is this I?” you’re going deeper and deeper within yourself, deeper and deeper, into oblivion, into emptiness, into the void. As you repeat, “Who am I?” the space between the thoughts, “Who am I” becomes greater and greater, and you begin to identify with the space between the thoughts of, “Who am I.” All of a sudden you find a profound peace overtaking you, a peace which passeth all understanding. This is not a peace that you’ve known before. It’s different. It’s a peace that overtakes you completely, and you lose your body awareness. It has nothing to do with the things of the world. It’s a blissful peace. You remain in that state. Included in the peace is a feeling of immortality. Without using words you just know, “I was never born and I can never die.” It’s as if you just studied a course at the university for five years, you’re so sure of these things. You just know that all is well and everything is unfolding as it should. There is nothing wrong anywhere. You feel wonderful. You have become your Self. You have not changed into anybody. You have become your natural Self. That is your true Self. This feeling never leaves you. It is always with you. Whether you work, or you sleep, or you do nothing, this profound peace, this love, this feeling of immortality never leaves you. The question arises, “Who is born, who dies?” and the answer comes, “No one.” There is no cause for existence. Existence is not real. You just know this. Whereas before you were identifying with the material world, the material world was real to you. But now you just know you have just become infinity itself. You become aware of the fact that this universe does not exist. And something tells you further that the universe exists as if in a dream, that’s all. When you’re dreaming, you find yourself in the universe. You’re flying in a plane, you’re cooking, you’re eating, you’re killing, you’re making love, you’re doing all kinds of things. It’s all happening in your dream. It seems so real. If anyone comes and tells you you’re dreaming, you refuse to believe them, because the dream appears very, very real. Then you wake up and you’re back to the waking state, which is just another dream. In any event, you are aware of all these things instantaneously, and no one can ever tell you again that the world is real. You are unable to explain it, for there are no words to describe reality. You just know. You also realize that there is nothing in all this dream world that can possibly harm you or cause you unhappiness, and you look at the world as an optical illusion. It appears to be here but it’s not. You consequently stop reacting to person, place or thing, for if you react you are identifying with the dream world. You don’t actually stop reacting. There’s something inside of you that no longer allows you to react. You have separated yourself from the relative universe. The question is, “Why do you want to become like this?” For it sounds to the average person like you become a babbling idiot. You’re no longer part of this world. You have to ask yourself therefore, “What is this world all about? This world is a world of constant change. Look at my body. I am not the same person I was ten years ago or twenty years ago. I’ve changed completely. And I’m getting older and the body will die sooner or later. What am I working for? Why do I do all these things I do every day? Why am I so concerned with this life and that life, and this person and that person, and the world situation? I do not understand anything.” And that’s the beginning of divine ignorance. You realize that you do not know what anything is. As an example, you look at a tree. You do not know what a tree is. You were born into a situation where a tree was evident for you. It’s just there. And people call it, tree. They could have called it dog or cat, but they call it a tree. Where did it come from? What came first, the seed or the tree? It’s a mystery. You don’t know. You look at a spider, a dog, a cat. What are they doing here? Where do they come from? What is their purpose? You have no idea what anything is and you have no idea what you are. Therefore you no longer condemn, you no longer hate, you no longer judge, you no longer find fault, you no longer try to change anybody. You leave the world alone. You leave people alone. You leave everything alone. You keep working on yourself. What are you doing with your life? How did you go through your life today? What kind of thoughts went through your mind? What kind of feelings, emotions did you have? You have to begin somewhere. Instead of identifying with your emotions, your problems, begin gradually to change by asking yourself the question, “Who am I? Who has these problems?” It makes no difference how long it takes. Time and space do not exist. They appear to exist. We have learned that whatever you say, whatever you do to someone else, however you act, returns to you. Why? Because there’s only one I. There is one Self. There are not two or three selves. There is only one Self. Therefore what I give to you, what I take from you, what I do to you, I am doing to myself. If I hate you, I hate myself. The trouble is we do not see the results immediately so we think were getting away with something. You cannot get away with anything. Everything always comes back to you. As an example: say you’re a pickpocket and you pick a persons pocket, and you find a wallet with $50,000, and you say, “Great. Look what I got,” You justify it. You say, “That person is rich, they don’t need it. I do,” You move to Canada and you buy a house, you get a job. Ten years pass. This is the falsity of time and space. There appears to be time, but there’s not. It’s really happening instantaneously, but time appears to be real. So ten years passed, you have a new home, new job. One day you come home. You find your house on fire. All of your personal belongings that you loved so much, have all burnt up. When you take an inventory you see that there was $50,000 worth of damage. It came back to you, but in a different way. When we understand these things we stop playing games and we get down to spiritual work. We forget about all these human traits, and we begin to realize, “My true nature is consciousness. I am absolute reality. I am pure awareness, ultimate oneness. This is my real nature. And even if I do not feel it right now, I am going to work on myself continuously even if it takes me ten million lifetimes, I will work on myself diligently and do what has to be done, until I become free.” The rest is up to you. Now let’s chant together Sri Ram, Jai Ram, Jai Jai Ram. (After the Chanting Robert continues) After that talk I will ask you the question, “Does a Sage get angry? What do you say?” (different students answer) SB: It appears that way. (more students guess) R: You’re on the right track. It depends on who is doing the seeing. It depends on what you see, where you are coming from. It has nothing to do with the Sage. It has to do with where you’re coming from. It’s like the old Buddhist question, “If you see a flag blowing in the breeze, is the breeze moving the flag or is the flag moving the breeze?” What’s the answer? (SE: It’s your mind moving.) That’s it, exactly. So it is with everything else. If you see a Sage becoming angry it is your mind inventing all this. The whole universe is a projection of your mind, so is everything that you see. SC: How about a bus is coming down the street, I’m just quoting what I’ve heard, you stand in front of that bus… (R: Where did you hear it from?) I heard it some place I don’t know? I’m sure it’s classic, I’m sure everyone has heard it. Is the bus real? You know what is going to happen if you stand in front of a bus or a car. (R: So what will happen?) Well reality will wipe you out. Physically the bus will destroy you. R: So you say reality will wipe you out? Well let me ask you. Say you are having a dream and in that dream a bus hits you and kills you, are you wiped out? (SC: I’m not talking about the dream.) But say you’re having the dream. (SC: In the dream, yes, in the dream you’ll be wiped out but you will wake up the next day, remembering the dream.) So how about when you wake up from this. (SC: Wake up what?) From this world? (SC: I’m not talking about that. I’m talking about physical actual reality.) That is what I am talking about too. (laughter) If I came into your world, if I came into your dream Nate. Say you are dreaming a bus is about to hit you and I come into your dream and I say, “Nathan, it’s a dream, the bus isn’t really going to kill you!” So you will talk to me just like you are doing now, you will say, “Robert your crazy, look there is the bus it’s about to hit me I’ve got to get out of the way before I get killed.” And then you wake up. (SC: However you know what I’m speaking about, I don’t want to start…) SU: Listen, who told you to walk in front of the bus? SC: I’m just saying if you are walking across the street and you don’t see the bus or you just see it too late and it hits you, that is what I’m saying. R: But if you are dreaming the same situation is taking place. And you are talking just like you are now. But then you wake up. (SC: I’m not talking about a dream. I know what you’re saying there is an actual dream and an actual…) SH: Are you sure your body is real just as you are dreaming? (SB: Are you your body?) SC: If someone were to hit me… (thud) …I felt that. R: So will you in the dream. (laughter) If I hit you in the dream you will also feel it. And you will be talking to me exactly like you are now but then you will wake up. So the reason for my talk today is allow you wake up and to see that this is a dream. (SC: Okay I’ll go along with that, I’m not denying that.) So why the question? SH: The question is a denial. (SC: What?) The question is a denial. SK: He’s waking up that’s why the question arose. SC: No, I’m not waking up, not yet! (students laugh) Look I feel like I’m making a fool out of myself. (SF: No you’re not! Not to me.) Well pursue it further then. (SF: It’s very simple. You have the same feeling as what you call being awake and what you call being a dream. You are making a distinction between them.) In the dream you wake up the next morning. But if a bus hits you if you wake up you will be in hospital, if you wake up! (SF: No, you will wake up. You haven’t woken up yet, but you will wake up.) SU: So what happens to the Sage if he gets hit by a bus? (laughter) SH: The body gets crushed. Nothing happens to the Sage. R: What happens is what you believe happens. What ever you see that’s what happens. To the Sage it’s nothing but you see something. Therefore whatever you see that is what you get. (SH: But the body will get crushed but the Sage is not the body, obviously.) Well in reality there is no body to get crushed. (SH: Well there will be that appearance that gets crushed.) There appears to be a body, to the ajnani. (SH: To the Jnani there is no appearance.) There is no appearance at all. (SH: Then he’s dissolved the world.) So it depends where we are coming from, what we see. This is why when some of these Sages have been dying from some of these horrible diseases and all their disciples are screaming and crying, “Look at you you are wasting away.” And they just laugh, there’s no one to waste away there is nobody’s there. SL: Could they not have more compassion for their students not to just waste away that way not wanting to disturb them? (R: They’re not interested.) You mean to say that Sages have no compassion for their students. Their hearts would be breaking seeing them being ill. R: The Sages realize that is how they learn, by shock. SK: To some that might be more compassionate to die that way? R: See, the realization again is there are no mistakes. It appears a mistake to you. But in reality there are no mistakes. There is no thing wrong. SL: Then it’s not a mistake for the pickpocket to have stolen the $50,000? R: If you look at it in relative terms it’s karma for both of them. (SL: Oh right of course. There is a murderer and a murderee.) They’re both related. (SL: Yes.) So they both have to go through that experience. (SL: So the person who is stolen from is just as much a part of the act) Exactly. But when you wake up you realize that there is nobody acting. There is nothing going on. It’s all an appearance like you’re watching a movie. The movie has a beginning a middle and an end. And then you go home. (SL: Then you go home.) (laughs) So your life has a beginning, a middle and an end and then you go home. But if you awaken before the end you will be awake while in the body, so-to-speak. SB: And you are always at home? (R: You are always home.) (tape break as Robert continues) R: The psychiatrist can’t save you. All the psychiatrist can do is make you normal. (laughter) Like everybody else. This is why no psychiatrist or psychologist has ever really helped anybody. They seem to help them for a while but they have got worse problems than they have had before. The problems never stop. Why? Who can tell me? SB: As long as there is an ego there is a problem. R: True, you are dealing from the viewpoint of the problem. And you cannot solve a problem that way at all. You have to deal from the viewpoint that you are consciousness. And follow the I and realize that I-am-that-I-am and all problems will dissolve. SF: You can’t solve the problem because you think the problem is real. R: Of course, so never try to solve a problem with a problem. By with a problem I mean you’re trying to use your mind to solve the problem and your mind is the problem all along. When the mind becomes quiet, quiescent, still, peaceful, calm there is no problem. It’s only when the mind is active that the problems appear to come and go. Well what do you think? SF: I’m thinking what I said to myself before. Perhaps there are different judgements to the two different dreams, dream number one equals dream and dream number two equals awake and the same happens to each of them and the first one there is buses coming, he knows it’s a real bus, absolutely sure about it. The same feeling that this dream here. The same thing happening but there is perhaps different bodies to it. R: This dream appears a little longer. (SH: It’s repetitive.) It seems to repeat itself. SB: If Nate gets hit by the bus he’ll say… (R: You like to talk about buses, huh.) (laughter) …if Nate gets hit by the bus he’ll say, “I’m in pain I got hit by the bus.” But who is it that is aware of the pain? Consciousness is aware of the pain. Consciousness is not the body then? R: Well if Nathan gets hit by a bus he has no time to think about all these things. He is screaming in pain. So it appears to be very, very real. That’s why you have to become realized before you get hit by a bus. (students laugh) SB: But there is something that’s aware of the incredible pain? The body is in incredible pain but there is a consciousness that is aware of that. So am I the body who is in incredible pain, or am I the consciousness who is aware of that pain? R: Consciousness is never aware of pain. Consciousness is aware of itself as absolute reality, as sat-chit-ananda. The pain is aware of its own pain because the pain is the ego. (SB: So the pain is the body-mind then.) Of course. (SB: So consciousness doesn’t even feel it?) What does consciousness have to do with the world. (SB: But it’s aware of the body-mind condition.) No it’s not. It couldn’t be. Otherwise it would think like we do. Consciousness is free of everything. (SB: So it’s always transcendental?) Always. (SB: And the whole body-mind phenomenon is only mind-body phenomenon.) The body-mind phenomenon doesn’t exist at all it appears to exist. And you give it reality because you identify with it. Change your identification and it will disappear. SN: It’s not that consciousness is transcendental it’s all there is. R: That’s all there is, right. SU: Why therefore would the Sage avoid a bus? R: A Sage acts spontaneously. (SU: True, but why avoid the bus?) A Sage doesn’t avoid or does avoid, doesn’t make any difference it just happens. A Sage doesn’t think about it. If he steps out of the way he steps out of the way. If he gets flattened he gets flattened. Makes no difference. (laughter) (SU: Does it matter to get hit by the bus?) It doesn’t matter to the Sage. (SU: It doesn’t matter ultimately, but what about in the moment?) In the moment it doesn’t matter. (SU: What?) If you are a Sage there is no moment in which to be different from what you really are. (SU: A real Sage and no bus?) To the Sage nothing is happening. (SU: A Sage might not find themselves in a position of danger or they might have to avoid that danger?) A Sage doesn’t think like that. To a Sage nothing is happening. (SU: There is no danger?) Only in your mind you see danger. But a Sage has no mind. (SU: A Sage doesn’t walk on the road?) Why not? Could be yes or no. Makes no difference. See you’re thinking a Sage has certain thoughts, but a Sage does not think at all. Whatever happens is fine. If it rains it rains, if it pours it pours, if it snows it snows. SU: I don’t know about this but why does a Sage be the kind of person who just thought the right amount not too much not too little? (laughter) R: Because you are creating a Sage in your own image. (SU: A Sage has no room for thought?) A Sage appears to do everything a human being does. But to the Sage they’re doing nothing, nothing is being done. It appears as if the Sage is acting but there is no action taking place. SD: So “appears” is a key word. (R: “Appears,” can be a key word, yes.) SK: Or body identification can be a keyword? (R: Or body identification, yes.) SC: Robert if the Sage knows that the bus will destroy people and he sees it coming he knows that the bus probably won’t get out of the way he will still deliberately walk? (R: No! A Sage doesn’t know anything you said.) No I said that he knows a bus destroys a person, he can’t be that unaware? (R: A Sage is completely empty.) Wow, that’s, that’s different. R: Well let’s look at this this way. Let’s change the name of the Sage to God. Call a Sage God. Does God get killed by a bus? (SC: You are twisting my words around I’m sorry. I’m serious.) No, lets intermingle and change the terms, Sage and God they are both synonymous. Can God get killed? Can God go in front of the bus? So a Sage has become a God. Therefore to a human being the bus appears to have flattened the Sage. And the Sage has become a pancake but to the Sage none of this is happening. (SC: Yes if you saw a bus coming would you with your instinct move you out of the way of the bus? Where you’re coming from?) I have got nothing to do with that. I would just do what has to be done. (SC: That’s what I am saying your instinct if you started walking, you see an abyss, you wouldn’t walk into the abyss?) Well of course not but it isn’t instinct, it’s just common sense. (SC: That’s what I’m saying. That’s what I said originally that the bus was coming, I wasn’t speaking about a Sage at the time I was speaking about anyone.) Oh well you’re calling a Sage anyone, we were referring to Sages. (SC: Trying to say it’s just common sense or instinct not to walk in front of a bus.) Well a human being of course, a human being has a choice to do whatever they like. (SC: A Sage is a human being in that sense.) To you! (SC: Physically he is a human being?) That’s how you see it. I’ll go back again to the sky is blue. When the sky is blue you say it looks beautiful. But in reality there is no sky and there is no blue. It’s an optical illusion. But when you look from here you say, “here is a beautiful blue sky.” Or when you are in the desert and you want a drink of water you see a mirage. You see an oasis. It doesn’t exist but you think it’s real. In the same way that’s how the Sage sees the world as an optical illusion. But he knows it’s an optical illusion, you don’t. SG: It’s sort of like being in disneyland. Like this is one event we are in right now and if you know it’s disneyland you should enjoy it and you get hit by a bus, that’s just another ride. (laughter) But you don’t get too concerned, if it happens, it happens. It’s just another traction. R: Well you can say that if you like. But to the Sage there is no coming and no going and nothing is ever happening. SC: I’m pursuing it. If someone told the Sage it could destroy his physical body and he saw this bus coming would he still persist? (R: Why would he persist?) He wouldn’t then because someone has told him that the bus could destroy his physical body. (R: Well why would he want to kill his physical body?) You said he’s an illusion, I said someone told him that the bus was an illusion but if I told him that the bus could actually destroy him then he wouldn’t, from what the knowledge he has he wouldn’t walk in front of the bus. You’re saying he would. R: No I’m not saying he would. I’m saying it would make no difference. It doesn’t make any difference. (SC: Even if he knew what would happen? Still would make no difference?) It would make no difference. SK: Maybe explaining the meaning of Sage would be helpful at this time? Define what Sage means both of you can have one understanding and get clarity by it. R: That’s the answer. A Sage is silence. Do you see what a Sage is now? Space, emptiness, no thing. If you define what a Sage is, it’s not that. SL: You said on Thursday that there was no cause and effect and we understand through the looking glass so-to-speak that we’re still very much aware of pictures and in question of human health which does concern us. Whether we think it’s real or what our understanding of it is — well it’s our value. Well most of the people have a value that it’s better to be healthy than to be sick. And watching people that we know become ill and die. I suppose we try to find out why this happens to people who appear good and strong. And in my own desire to find out what happened to people who are close to me. It seemed to appear to me that down deep inside from real consciousness they had either a mindset of rage or hopelessness or feeing that life was not worthwhile. Is this cause and effect? Is there any reason to think about that? R: You are speaking in relative terms and that is part of the relative world. So if you are identifying with the relative world you have got to do everything you have to do to take care of your body, your health and everything else. But that is in the relative world. (SL: But is that not wise for us then Robert?) Of course. As long as think you are the body and the mind you have to do everything you can to take care of yourself. So you eat right, you exercise, you take care of yourself. But once you understand who you are everything changes. (SL: But is it not so that people could one even say make themselves sick?) Well of course. In the relative world you can do anything. You can make yourself sick, you can make yourself well, you can kill yourself, you can make yourself the healthiest person on earth. Whatever you like to do you do. (SL: You don’t need the worlds greatest health insurance to realize that.) It’s all part of the game. It’s all cause and effect. But you have nothing to do with that. Your real Self is beyond that. Your real Self is beyond time and space. (SL: But even the understanding of that will affect us on the – what do we call that…?) The relative world. (SL: …the relative plane.) Well first understand that and then ask me if it’s so. (SL: I’m sorry I lost you?) That you are not real. (SL: I believe that.) That’s not good enough. (SL: Is there another step?) When you understand your true reality there will be no question like that. The question is only for the ajnani or the person who does not understand. (SL: There are two words that I don’t understand here they are jnani and ajnani.) There are two Jnanis. (laughter) No. Ajnani is the opposite of Jnani. Jnani means wisdom, infinite wisdom. So ajnani is ignorance. (SL: I see now.) (general talk between students) R: Let’s listen to some more music. (music played) Feel free to continue asking questions. Whatever is on your mind. SX: Robert can we have someone read a poetry I just saw in todays newspaper, just a short poetry? R: Of course sir. Mary can read it. Would you like to read it Mary? (SX: Thank you.) In todays newspaper? (SX: Yes, today’s newspaper.) What could we possibly find in todays newspaper? Mary: This is called ‘Petition for a Nuclear Freeze,’ by Mary Tyler Mountain. In the brief interface of the moments light dangling time like the poise of the dancers heel before the final pirouette across the galaxies. We search the impervious planets a familiar signal. We probe the stars with silver shafts for some new land bridge but stars are veiled and silent. Unseen watchers who perceive the devils dance of nations. The great lethal video game may know it comes tomorrow that last astounding flash in the dust. We will not have time to go with the path of Athahula- pula, Emperor of the Inca. He shall leave no students like his. To mark our fleeting presence. Only the feathers of our fiery selves summons to ashes blown on impeccable winds. From the light on the tent wall, American Indian study centre. R: Thank you, we have enough trouble with sat-chit-ananda now we have to know how to hoopa-hulla. (students laugh aloud) That was nice Frederick. SX: Bob, the reason I brought the poetry, I was reading a book, an astronomy book about the high temperatures of the stars. Something we can’t even imagine to measure and such amount of power really shake me thinking about the powers of the universe, whom we really are. (R: Yes.) And that potential to understand anything around us. It sounds like we didn’t really have any chance to do that one. R: Of course when you understand that the whole universe is an emanation of your own mind then you will realize that you are the power. There is no power outside of you. You are that and your whole perspective changes. This is why it’s so important to find our own reality because we are always giving something outside of ourselves credit. As being a mighty power, a mighty force something having control over ourselves. But this is not true. The Self is consciousness and you are that and there is no other power besides you. Mary: Can I read something? (R: Of course.) This is just something I just want you to read first: This is called “Illusion.” God and I in space alone and nobody else in view, and where are the people oh Lord I said the earth below, and the sky overhead, and the dead whom I once knew That was a dream God smiled and said, a dream that seemed to be true There were no people living or dead, There was no earth or sky overhead. There was only myself and you Why do I feel no fear I asked, meeting you here in this way For I have sinned I know full well, and there is heaven and there is hell And is this the Judgement Day? Nay, those were dreams the great God said, Dreams that have ceased to be, There are no such things as fear or sin, There is no you, you have never been. There is nothing at all but you. (loud appreciation from students) Mary: I was just giving it to Robert to see if he would like to have it. It’s called Illusion by Ella Wheeler Wilcox. Isn’t that beautiful? I had it sent to me. Mary: I know I just love it. (SH: Sounds just like Robert.) Oh I know it does and can I read one other thing? (R: Sure.) Now these ahead are self-themed. These are beautiful too. This is called the rules for being human. (R: Did you make enough for everybody?) Yes I made 25 copies of those, I didn’t make the other ones because I didn’t know whether Robert wanted that too but I made 25 copies; The first is: You will receive a body you may like it or hate it but it will be yours the entire period this time around. Number two: You will learn lessons. You are enrolled in a full time informal school called life. Each day in this school you will have an opportunity to learn lessons. You may like the lessons or think them irrelevant and stupid. And Three: There are no mistakes only lessons. Growth is a process of trial and error of experimentation. The failed experiments are as much as part of the process as the experiments that ultimately works. And Four: A lesson is repeated until learned. A lesson will be presented to you in various forms until you have learned it. And when you have learned it you can then go on to the next lesson. And Five: Learning lessons does not end. There is no part of life that does not contain its lessons. If you are alive there are lessons to be learned. And Six: There is no better than here. When your there has become a here you will simply attain another there that again will look better than here. And Seven: Others are merely mirrors of you. You cannot love or hate something about another person unless it reflects to you, something you love or hate about yourself. Eight: What you make of your life is up to you. You have all the tools and resources you need. What you do with them is up to you. The choice is yours. Nine: Your answers lie inside you. The answers to life’s questions lie inside you. All you need to do is look, listen and trust. And number Ten: You will forget all this. (appreciation from students) R: That’s good. SB: So has the Jnani learned all the lessons and he has no lessons? (SF: No there never was any lessons.) (R: That’s it, what he just said.) SF: Robert as these directed to the ego? (R: To the ego? Yes, they’re for the ego.) They are for the ego then. R: If you have no ego what do you need this for? People like to play with the ego. We like to play hide and seek. We hide the ego and then we find it. And we go on like this again and again until the ego disappears. So what have you to say? Comments, questions? (pause) Is there anything else you would like to say? Or a question, comment, whatever you like. SC: I’ll say a comment, I’ve got two comments. One I noticed that some of us have something to say and the majority of the people apparently here — which is okay — don’t say anything. The other thing after this talking about the bus incident it seems that the Jnani is in a different world than anyone else. And that it’s like a woman, you are either pregnant or you’re not, you are there, you’re not and there is nothing that anyone, you or the ego can do. There is nothing you can do if it happens which makes me feel a little sad I guess because I was under the illusion that maybe someday things will be different. R: Well let me say this. Anyone who has achieved any kind of spiritual knowledge whether they were born with it or just came upon them has worked for it in a previous life. Therefore don’t feel there is no hope. Keep working on yourself do not look for results. Just like you have to go to the bathroom everyday. You have to eat everyday. Do spiritual practice everyday and don’t think about it. You will be surprised at what happens. SR: Robert, isn’t what Nate is saying just another name for humility anyway? (R: You can say that too, of course.) And that’s the best quality we can have? R: Yes. But do not think that it’s impossible to obtain freedom and liberation because it is not. I think you are under the illusion that it is impossible to obtain freedom and liberation. It’s difficult for you. You can never tell. Do not think about it do the practice and see what happens. Everybody is the same, there is no difference. SX: (Student who brought poem from the newspaper questions what people can do to stop these negative situations happening in the world, not very clear on tape.) (tape break. Robert continues.) R: …Because when you become self-realized you become omnipresent. Your Self is the Self of the universe. There are not two selves or three selves. There is one Self and when you realize your true Self, you realize the whole universe as your true Self. Your true Self is harmony and bliss. Your true Self is absolute reality. When you can see that in your Self you will see that in everyone else and you will see a different world. One of love and peace. So find your Self and your feelings will change accordingly. Do you follow that? (S: Yeah.) You are responsible for what you see. If you’re seeing something you don’t like the way to change it is not by changing the condition. As an example: Let’s say we stop the war in Iraq and there is a peaceful settlement. Three years from now there will be another conflict somewhere else. And we’ll have the same condition. And if we stop that a couple of years later it will be something else. It never stops. You cannot change a condition, change yourself and the condition will change. SL: Is it good to love the condition. Someone said hate of Hitler, is hate… (R: I understand what you’re saying.) In other words if we can really love Hitler easily there’s understanding? R: If you can’t find yourself and understand the truth about your Self then you have to love and hate. That’s natural. You can’t tell a person to stop hating Hitler and to love Hitler. They can’t do it, it’s impossible. Don’t try! (SL: But what if a person actually can love?) No you can’t. You’re just putting it on. The only thing you can do is to change yourself. (SL: It is going to be difficult without that?) Well tell me that when you change yourself. When you lift yourself higher you see a whole new universe. Everything becomes brand new and everything is different. So you have to work on yourself and accordingly make the changes within yourself. It’s like the question Pedro asked. Do not try to love or hate anyone. Work on yourself. Transcend the world and then see what you feel. SD: So you’re saying that by working on myself my perspective will change? (R: Yes.) It’s a matter of perspective. (R: Yes.) SX: When you say the world, you also mean the universe and everything, the stars and…? R: Yes, because everything is a projection of your mind. So by changing your mind you are changing the universe. I know it sounds strange but it’s true. SL: Then with our mind we could actually disarm it. R: (laughs) We don’t look at it that way. You work on yourself and Hitler becomes a part of yourself. And you see a whole new perspective. What you cannot see now. Now you have to change people. SL: This is going to sound wildly ego denying. The reason I feel I can really love Hitler, really is because I know in my earlier condition I felt such rage I actually thought of killing my mother. I mean I didn’t actually do it or anything but there were times when she would be dead… (R: Why?) Well I understand my condition then because I was fearful that she would hurt me. But now I love her, I adore her, I wish I could see her again. I completely understand her condition was what made her act that way. So I believe my feelings of fear and rage must be the same kind of feelings that Hitler had I’ve come through that, I would wish the same for you. (R: But he is dead.) Well I mean for that kind of person. R: That’s very commendable but if that person raped you or hurt you, you wouldn’t think the same thing would you? (SL: My mother hurt me and I did that.) Now you do. (SL: Yes.) But before you didn’t. (SL: But now I have the same perspective of the understanding so I can say that for everything.) Is your mother dead? (SL: Yes.) That’s why you love her. But if she were alive, would you love her if she was alive? If she were alive you probably wouldn’t love her. It’s easier to love somebody when they are dead. (SL: Yeah.) (laughs) But forget about all that. See yourself in reality. Go deep within yourself and expand your consciousness and become free. (SL: Is this not like on the card you gave us about compassion. Is that not like working on yourself to realize that?) Working on yourself is commendable. But that’s the hard way to try to change your emotions. Rather see who has the emotions. Find out who has them and get rid of the I that has the emotions and then you will be free. (pause) R: Okay so let’s practice. We call this meditation and we are going to do something with ourselves to see what happens. Make yourself comfortable. You can close your eyes to remove obstructions. Focus your attention on your breath. Become the witness to your breath. When your mind starts thinking gently go back to your breath and focus all of your energy on your breath, on your respiration. You are witnessing your breath. Ask yourself the question, “Who is the witness? Who is witnessing the breath?” The answer comes, “I am.” With your respiration when you inhale say, “I,” to yourself when you exhale say, “am.” “I am.” If your mind wanders gently bring it back. I am is the first name of God, it is you. I am that I am, it is consciousness, it is yourself. By repeating this with your respiration you become it. Gently go back to I-am. Gradually the space between “I” and “Am” will widen. Any further comments, questions, criticisms, answers? (tape ends)